Repository path: workshop/translations/iliad-sarpedon/R08-v1/translation.md · rendered 2026-09-09
Page metadata (front matter)
| type | translation |
|---|---|
| id | T-iliad-sarpedon-R08-v1 |
| status | frozen |
| created | 2026-08-02 |
| updated | 2026-08-02 |
| translated-by | lead |
| contamination | none |
| senses | naturalness, accuracy, style-correspondence, cultural-mediation |
| internal-judgment-only | true |
| provisional | true |
| links | workshop/regimes/R08-resistancy.md, workshop/translations/iliad-sarpedon/R07-v1/translation.md, workshop/experiments/E-20260802b-pole-uniformity/design.md, wiki/base/anchors/A-homer-sarpedon/A-homer-sarpedon.md, wiki/arms/ARM-fluency-record.md |
T-iliad-sarpedon-R08-v1 — Iliad XII.310–327, Sarpedon to Glaucus, under R08 (resistancy)
- Source: as
T-iliad-sarpedon-R07-v1— Homer, Iliad XII.310–327, Monro–Allen OCT via Perseus. Public domain. - Regime:
R08v1.0 (frozen). The paired mirror of theR07rendering, same locus, same session, same translator, written second. - Translated by: the lead agent, as a labeled subject. Cost $0; not ledgered (charter §3, A4).
- Contamination:
none— the same measured gate as theR07artifact, reproduced there in full. The line-328 exposure is declared there and 328 is outside this locus too. - Evaluation: none yet. The lead never judges its own translation (charter §5).
The translation
Glaukos, why is it that we two are honoured beyond all others, with the seat and with the meats and with the fuller cups, in Lykia, and all look upon us as upon gods, and we pasture a great temenos beside the banks of Xanthos, a fair one, of orchard-ground and of wheat-bearing tilth? Therefore now it is needful, being among the foremost Lykians, to stand, and to go against the burning battle, that one of the close-corsleted Lykians may say: "Not gloryless, these, our kings, who lord it down through Lykia; and they eat the fat sheep, and the wine picked out, honey-sweet; but their strength too is good, since among the foremost Lykians they fight." Soft one — for if indeed, this war once fled from, we two were going to be ageless and deathless always — I would not myself fight among the foremost, nor would I send you into the man-ennobling battle; but as it is, since anyhow the Keres of death stand over, ten thousand of them, which it is not for a mortal to flee nor to slip out from under
165 English words from 18 Greek lines — 19 fewer than the R07 rendering of the same lines.
Translator's log
Written as the draft was written, frozen by commit before any evaluation was designed. Coverage codes
are R08 §5's strict test; INT marks a decision made by interpreting what the source means
rather than by any rule (R08 §5a).
| # | site (Greek) | live options | chosen | code | rules | note |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 1 | Γλαῦκε, Λυκίῃ, Ξάνθοιο | Glaucus/Lycia/Xanthus · Glaukos/Lykia/Xanthos | Glaukos / Lykia / Xanthos | D | R7 | R7 requires source-culture particulars unassimilated. One survivor. |
| 2 | νῶϊ (dual) | we · we two | we two | D | R5 | R5 forbids withholding what the source marks; English cannot mark the dual otherwise. |
| 3 | ἕδρῃ τε κρέασίν τε ἰδὲ πλείοις δεπάεσσιν | rebuild as an English list · with the seat and with the meats and with the fuller cups | the second | D | R2, R6 | R2 requires the clause order and period length; the repeated with keeps the bare datives visible. |
| 4 | πλείοις δεπάεσσιν (comparative) | always-full cups · fuller cups | fuller cups | D | R4, R5 | The comparative has no stated standard and R5 forbids supplying one. |
| 5 | θεοὺς ὣς εἰσορόωσι | treat us like gods · look upon us as upon gods | the second | D | R2, R6 | The doubled preposition calques the Greek's ὣς comparison rather than idiomatizing it. |
| 6 | τέμενος | estate · precinct · temenos | temenos | D | R7 | R7 names institutions explicitly, and forbids the gloss. |
| 7 | νεμόμεσθα | hold · possess · pasture | pasture | D | R4 | R4 requires keeping the polysemy open; only pasture carries graze and hold-as-pasturage. |
| 8 | ἀρούρης πυροφόροιο | wheat fields · wheat-bearing tilth | wheat-bearing tilth | D | R3, R6 | R6 calques the compound; R3 licenses tilth, which is dated and opens the sense ploughed land that field closes. |
| 9 | μάχης καυστείρης | fierce fighting · the burning battle | the burning battle | D | R6 | The fire figure is not English and R6 prefers the word-for-word rendering of it. |
| 10 | πύκα θωρηκτάων | heavily armoured · close-corsleted | close-corsleted | D | R3, R6 | Compound calqued; corslet is dated and R3 licenses it. |
| 11 | οὐ μὰν ἀκλεέες | they rule with honour · not gloryless | Not gloryless | D | R6 | Litotes and privative compound both kept. |
| 12 | κοιρανέουσιν | rule · are lords over · lord it down through | lord it down through | P | R2, R8 | R8 licenses the mixed register and R2 the κάτα + accusative; are lords over Lykia also satisfies both. Two survivors. |
| 13 | οἶνόν … ἔξαιτον μελιηδέα | the best sweet wine · the wine picked out, honey-sweet | the second | D | R6, R2 | Both epithets calqued and left in the Greek's order, after the noun. |
| 14 | ὦ πέπον | my friend · good friend · Soft one | Soft one | D | R6, R3 | The literal sense of πέπον is ripe, soft. R6 prefers the calque. This is the site R9 was consulted at — the reading is odd, and it stops short of the parodic because it is a recorded English address form in the epic register. |
| 15 | ἀγήρω τ' ἀθανάτω τε | never grow old and live forever · ageless and deathless | ageless and deathless | D | R6 | Both privative adjectives calqued and paired as the Greek pairs them. |
| 16 | anacoluthon at 322–324 | repair into a conditional · leave the break | leave the break | D | R1 | R1 names discontinuity directly. The double dash carries it. |
| 17 | πόλεμον περὶ τόνδε φυγόντε | if we escaped this war · this war once fled from | the second | D | R2, R5 | The participial phrase kept in its Greek position, ahead of the apodosis, and not unpacked. |
| 18 | μάχην ἐς κυδιάνειραν | the battle where men win glory · man-ennobling battle | man-ennobling battle | D | R6 | Compound calqued. |
| 19 | κῆρες … θανάτοιο μυρίαι | death waits in countless forms · the Keres of death, ten thousand of them | the second | D | R6, R7 | R7 retains the divinities unassimilated and unglossed; R6 keeps stand over. INT: whether μυρίαι is "ten thousand" or "countless" is decided by reading, not by a rule — taken as the numeral because the Greek numeral is live and R4 keeps it open. |
| 20 | end of locus at 327 | close the sentence · leave it open | leave it open | D | R1, R5 | The Greek's apodosis is at 328, outside the locus. R1 and R5 both forbid supplying a close. |
20 logged decisions, at the same 20 sites as the R07 log — the site list was written once, from
the Greek, and both regimes were run down it. Tallies are computed by analysis/logparse.py.
What the two regimes did at the same sites
Recorded here as fact, not as a finding: the two logs diverge at 18 of 20 sites and converge at
two — site 2 (both mark the dual, by different rules) and site 12 (R07 has no logged row for
κοιρανέουσιν because nothing in F1–F10 named it, and R08 records two survivors there). The
convergences are as informative as the divergences and are counted by the script rather than by eye.
One observation, flagged
internal-judgment-only. R10 (abusive fidelity) was never invoked, and R9 was consulted
once. The rule that R08's own §Known limitations calls the one that "can absorb anything" did not
absorb anything here, because on a source 2,700 years old the abuse the source performs on its own
language is not available to be reproduced analogically — there is no contemporary register for it to
be abusive against. That is a limit of R08 on ancient sources, and it is a statement about the
rule set, not about the rendering.